OHS parents crowd school board meeting on Owatonna

By: viking77 on 11/24/09
Ignorance on the side of the administration. When the principal Don Johnson lied numerous times to the media he is not setting a good role model for my students. There were many students who witnessed this incident so I am sure in time the "real truth" will come out. The school board should step up to the plate and hold people accountable for their actions. When Tom Tapper lied to the parents involved that should not be allowed. I understand that they "want things back to normal" but sweeping things under the rug and lying is not the answer. Give the people of this community the truth..teacher approved paper was posted...30+ Somolians involved in the fight..things were not handled in the proper manner following the incident...this was a problem before the incident involving so many children...etc.
I could go on and on but the fact of the matter is it not a race issue it is an issue of equality of students of all color at the OHS. When people feel that there is unfairness it causes hard feelings which causes tension.
But this is only my opinion...just like the paper(s) that have been written where the children were disciplined by suspension..but their main subjects of their letter were ignored. Administration take action b-4 the problem escaletes..this is where you have failed this district especially the students at OHS.

By: Bobo777 on 11/24/09
"In addition to criticizing the administration, parents and community members who turned out for the meeting recited back the words from the pledge of allegiance which was said at the open of the meeting: 'One Nation Under God.' Others quoted the Constitution of the United States and argued that the student who wrote the opinions that escalated tension to this point had a right to express himself."

Although I am not surprised this happened, will someone answer this simple question. Why do some people feel the need to hijack the Constitution and Christianity to use it in their arguments that their white children are innocent and didn't do any harm? They're no angels in this, as evidenced in what was written and distributed to other students.

By: budlight on 11/24/09
cant we all please all get along? thank you.

By: Franklin on 11/24/09
A few weeks ago a Savannah TV station ran this editorial. If I'm not mistaken I think this might be the beliefs many people are having.

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/seton-motley/2009/11/24/savannah-georgia-cbs-affiliate-takes-political-correctness-task-air-ed

Point well made.

By: NewHome on 11/24/09
Bush, your ignorance is astounding. Have a wonderful Thanksgiving.

By: viking77 on 11/24/09
Bush..you are not worth my time. Just a thought thou, have you tried therapy?

By: civiltongued on 11/24/09
Wolfman - you probably don't want to go to New Prague or Lonsdale on a Sunday afternoon and listen to the old guys speak Czech. We lived in Gustine, California while my husband was in the Air Force and the people there were 4th generation Americans who still spoke Portuguese. They had mass on Sundays in Portuguese and a festival in the fall celebrating their ethnic background. What do you think Kolache days are in Montgomery? It seems we only want to require people to speak "English" in public that are not white. Also - if you travel abroad should other countries force us not to speak English while we are there?

Also, from all of the bad grammar and spelling on this blog, one has to wonder if these people who say they went to OHS actually went to class.

By: tireman43 on 11/24/09
if you didn't catch it "Kolacky".

By: civiltongued on 11/24/09
tireman43 - this is way off the subject but my husband is full bloodied Czech and they speak it at the Lonsdale Liquor Store, the Legion and at the ball games on Sundays as well as in the local grocery stores and at wedding dances, etc.; not just in their homes. Also, his family has always spelled it "Kolache." And I think using the English language well is necessary if your arguement is that people should speak English. What do you mean "use English the way everyone else does"? Did you mean use it badly?

By: tireman43 on 11/24/09
You brought up the language issue. I'm saying that english is the primary language in the USA. That was my point. Use it at schools and restaurants and liquor stores. I am very sure that your husband, not knowing me, would not speak to me in Czech.

And your spelling is still off.
blood"i"ed.........Sorry back to the topic.

By: smile on 11/24/09
I would love for you to visit this site:
http://www.acomplaintfreeworld.org/

Spewing negativity day after day can do terrible things to you and the ones you love.

By: tireman43 on 11/24/09
-smile- If you are referring to me. The ones I love and myself are great. That is a great site, if we had a perfect world. We do not, however, by proof of the things written here and the actions that have occured. Everyone disagrees on things and that is why complaining once in a while may help us better ourselves and others. I also think if we keep turning a blind eye and don't express how we feel then none of this will get better.

By: tireman43 on 11/24/09
I didn't say anything about your misspelling arguement, but thanks for that one. It was bobo who said that. And I'm not sure about your crow comment, but we can leave it at that. And I too am thankful. To be born and raise in good old Owatonna. It just seems we are having a few road bumps which need to be addressed.

You have a wonderful Thanksgiving as well.

By: OpPrEaDeR on 11/24/09
I don't think that the issue at hand is racial.........I also don't think that the student that wrote the paper should have been suspended........Freedom Of Speech. This was a long time coming and everyone is shocked that it happened. I felt the same way when I was in school, but I never spoke out about it, and now that someone does its racist. No it is not. I don't consider myself racist but I feel the same way. I don't think that it's only school age equality issues either, this is all the way through adulthood. I also think that DURING SCHOOL TIME, every student should be required to speak english only, the teachers for the most part can't understand other languages and most students can't either, and yes I understand that speaking there languages are part of there heritage, BUT not every one can understand it. What if a group of students are talking amongst eachother in another language planning to beat up another student, sure a teacher walks by, but chances are good that they aren't going to understand it and just keep on walking. Perfect example of something that could have been stopped IF this rule was implemented. Bush, read before you speak, no "white parents" are claiming there kids are victims, they are all equally to blame. What was the fight 20 to 4, what ever happened to one on one? Now, I am not encouraging fighting, but seriously thats a little ridiculous 20 to 4. I don't think this is the end of this either, the police officers will eventually go away and that is when something bigger will happen. Also some people that write on here need to grow up........for example picking out spelling errors, seriously grow up.

By: Americansweetheart on 11/24/09
I blame the white sutdents in the fight for all of this. And what is up with all these people bringing up things like special treatment, like since when did become an issue. Leave these poor somalian kids alone. And let things go back to the way they were.

By: SportsMom on 11/24/09
Bush - Your attitude is EXACTLY why things will never change. I just got back from the meeting at the school and I am sick to my stomach as to total disregard to the issues that started this whole mess. "That white boy started this whole thing". OK, he did. The students that were offended complained to the school administrators and rightfully so. The student was suspended and punished. End of story. Oh! wait! it's not. Because someone's feelings were hurt and were offended gave them the right to beat the crap out of this "white boy"? Are you insane? And to listen to the Somalian mother look me in the face and say that it escalated to this point because "boys will be boys"! Unbelievable. This meeting the school had did nothing except make excuses for unexcusable behavior on everyones part. White and black. The underlying issue is that there is a perception in the school that students are not treated equally and fairly, REGARDLESS of race and religion. The administration REFUSES to acknowledge that this perception exists. Right or wrong, it is an issue that needs to be addressed. Until it is, you can check every bag, every day and it will NOT get rid of the underlying issues that apparently will never get addressed.

By: ss_observing on 11/24/09
PS - ignore Bush - maybe he'll/she'll go away.

By: SportsMom on 11/24/09
ss_observing - Call me niave I guess. It just annoys me to no end that people can stand up and spout all the platitudes of harmony, diversity, getting along and accepting each other for their differences and then use the excuse for their own childs behavior as "boys will be boys". Please tell me Bush and Americansweetheart -is it normal for your culture to make excuses for this kind of behavior? I have heard that the Somalian culture believes that women are inferior to males. Is this true? Is it true that "people of my kind - white females" would not be allowed to eat at the Jubba restaraunt? Please enlighten me.... are the things I am told fact or fiction? I would really like to know. People get upset and angry over things they are unfamiliar with and don't know what is the truth. I am asking, what is the truth?

By: Americansweetheart on 11/24/09
Umm sportsmom- we somalian do believe iin equality too, to dont come at us like that. As for who ever told yu boys will be boys was right. Because the white student who wrote the letter knew it was going to set us off and he even came to our area at the highschool where we hang out, so he was the instigator, he was wrong for that and the somali boys were wrong for beating him up so hard. so i do admit that was wrong.

But i can honestly say that i'm like the only somalian in this comments, because the reason why most of us dont interfere with these comments or the paper is some people are just ignorant. so if we said nothing than no one would listen and they might even turn and twist the things we say. Black people have history of not being accepted here and now everyone is labeling muslims as terrorist.. so guess wat! We are not appreciated here.. gawd! we feel that most people dont like us here. And they dont. i have been victimized especially after the fight, the incident at the highschool. so unless this thing is over and done and things go bak to the way it was. we are nto speaking.

ps: much love to those marvelous white folks who still believe somalian are fun, caring, normal pleasant people, which we still are& will always be ^^

By: SportsMom on 11/24/09
Americansweetheart - I am asking as an "ignorant white person" what is the truth and what is not. I am just curious as to why you did not answer my specific questions? The only way the "ignorant" can be enlighted is to have the "intelligent" people tell us what is the truth and what is not? You are telling me that this "white boy" instigated this altercation by coming into "your area where you hang out"? You have your own designated area where other students aren't allowed?

By: VoiceOfReason on 11/24/09
Hmmm I wonder why this issue is not going to go away any time soon? Ding...it is the parents. Just reading the comments of people in these forums and in the paper it is clear as day that the behavior of the students are a direct result of the actions and beliefs of the parents. This issue is not going to die down until all the parents involved put their agenda to bed and let by gones be by gones and let time heal the hurt feelings on both sides. I do not agree with the paper that started this controvery, I don't agree with the kids involved in the fight and I don't agree with the way the school administration has dealt with the issue.

By: median on 11/24/09
I never thought that I would be opt to share my opinion on this site but I can't bite my tounge anymore, I will not hide what race I am at all I am a "White" student who attends the Owatonna High School. After looking at all of these opinions from who I am assuming to be parents and possibly students and I am appauled at what everyone thinks is "right" and "wrong" now I know off hand that not everyone is going to agree with everything I say as I don't agree with what everyone else says. But then again this is an "opinion poll" and that is what I am here to submit. I believe as a student from the OHS that yes the administration has "covered" things up and yes a mother at the meeting was right on the money about how details NEED to be shared so people are more aware of what has happened. I also don't agree with the administration making it seem like it is ALL of the boy who wrote this papers fault. Both parties are guilty, which one is more guilty? I am not the one to say. If someone were to write a paper about the "white" race as discriminating as the papers that were written about the "samolian" culture I know that we would all be very very upset, now would something happen as bad as a student ending up in the hospital? I have no idea. I would hope not. For it to get as far as a student ending up in a hospital is completley wrong. But for parents at this meeting to start attacking every little detail about what a culture does differently and how it is wrong, is completley unacceptable in my eyes. You cannot sit there and tell me if we were to go to another country that we would completley change to "fit" in, no we would not, that would be crazy and quite frankly we would be affended by it. Also what a lot of parents who were so upset about samolian culture at this meeting have obviously forgotten that a lot of samolian students who attend the high school were born in the U.S.A and they are american citizens so how does that make then completley one hundred percent different from us?? Who cares about who gets a prayer room or who says the pledge, when we are in the middle of trying ot make sure that guns aren't going to be brought to school. I'm sorry but a childs safety at school is WAY more important than bickering about who prays where and who is right. I think that for the administration to stop doing bag checks and taking the same steps that they are now is opening the door for horrible things to happen to us students. These percautions need to be taken through out the year, because obviously from this meeting tonight this issue is far from over, and there will be a lot more tension especially when parents are still soo upset over what has happened. If I were the parent of the student that got beaten up I would be very very upset and hurt to by the administration, and I am very very proud of that mom to stand up and speak her mind tonight when Tapper so rudly ignored her when she had very important things to say. I just think that it is time for Owatonna as a WHOLE community to come together and stop bickering about differences for the safety of the children that are being raised in this city.

By: Jeepster87 on 11/24/09
About Tiny's post, yes it is true as I was student at the OHS a few years back and everything that had to do with race was swept under the rug, due to the schools being afraid of a law suit due to someone flipping the race card like the get out of jail free card in monopoly

By: truthbetold on 11/24/09
Anyone whose been a student at OHS knows that different groups have their "area" In my day the Seniors...usually the "Jocks" had the benches above the Indian doors. The "burn outs" had the water tower and "the store"..off school property for obvious reasons. If the Somali usually hang out in one area, I don't think it's because the lay claim to it...it just happens that way. We all do that! Even in church we usually sit in the same spot. You know if a family is missing because their "spot" is empty. I don't think Americansweetheart was laying claim. I think she was wondering why this boy would write such a mean paper, and then hang out where the people he hates so much tend to be.
When I sit and think about it, I really don't mind that these kids are allowed to pray. I would, however, be upset if my child was late to class, and told the teacher that they were having a bad day, and felt the need to find a private place to pray, and were disciplined for it. I would also mind if any kids was constantly entering class 20 minutes late, and it disrupted my child's learning. The issue here really isn't with the Somali people. It is with those who are making exceptions. If it is really that important to you, take it to the next level. I agree with the person who suggested running for the school board. Why stop there, why not run for government? I am being serious here! Make a stand with the lawmakers who are supposed to be representing you. If they don't listen, don't vote for them. About the letter...I have no problem with this boy voicing his opinion about things he finds unfair. I do have a problem with him being verbally abusive and derogatory towards the Somali community. What if the tables were turned? Whatever happend to "if you don't have anything nice to say, say nothing at all."
Please understand that this does not have anything to do with voicing your opinion, in a civil way, about an injustice.

By: alittlebitofsugar on 11/24/09
I know that a number of posters to this site are frustrated with the lack of clarity after this afternoons meeting. From what I have read on other sites, here are some of the issues that have helped me form my conclusions. I hope you can put your positions aside for a moment and to try to just understand a viewpoint which may or may not be different from yours. I am simply trying to take emotion out of the equation to promote a better understanding of the issues.
1. Information – As I see I, the main problem has been availability of information. I want more information. A number of posters want more information. I do not think that any of us truly understand the data privacy issues that public school officials are required to work under. They do not write the laws, they just have to follow them. If I were in their position, I would have concerns about crossing that line. I also understand the reluctance to give factual statements before you have all the facts. Sometimes this looks like evasiveness, but the other choice is making decisions or drawing conclusions without all the facts. One parent raised the question about guilt by association for students in the future. You cannot make an informed decision without information. I know those of you who are skeptical about Dr. Tapper and Dr. Johnson will disagree with me on this point, and I can accept that. I guess I am just saying that I understand their choice to be thorough and to have OPD take over since this is what they have been trained to do. I would hope and expect that their focus would be on making sure that they stabilize the environment, and not allow any retaliatory or copy cat incidences to take place.

2. Religion – I am a Christian. A long time ago, our school calendars were formed around Christian holidays. We have Good Friday off. We have an extended break at Christmas time. Whether you or I would like to see more faith in our schools is not the issue. It certainly is not the fault of the school or those in our community that are Muslim. The ALCU fought long and hard through our court systems to kick every Christian symbol/tradition out of our schools and government. Some of you may agree with the ACLU. Any issue you or I would have is with them. If our schools were in session on Sundays, you better believe that practicing Christians (myself included) would be up in arms over the school infringing on our called time of worship. I often wondered why most school events at OHS happened on Mondays, Tuesdays, Thursdays, Fridays, and Saturdays? I am not sure if it is by design, but I have always been thankful that my child has not had to choose between Wednesday night faith events and school events.

In listening to Dr. Tapper and Dr. Johnson at the parent meeting, I was wondering how other schools have dealt with this prayer issue. After googling the subject, I read a piece about San Diego schools dealing with this issue. They said “The district's legal obligation in response to a request that a prayer must be performed at a particular time is to treat that request the same as it would treat a student's request to receive an insulin shot at a particular time.” They also stated that federal law required them to do so. I personally did not understand that Muslims have a requirement to do their prayers at specific times to properly practice their faith. Same goes with the women’s garments. One of the students at todays forum captured is best for me. She said that the Muslim prayer time has had no impact on her educational opportunity. I am happy that my faith is not so rigid, because I am not sure if my child would have the discipline to follow such a strict routine. So my point is that our school district is not alone in how they are handling this issue. Our choice is deciding whether or not we can accept others that are different from us.
3. Kids – I respect ANYONE who wants more in life for their children than they have for themselves. If you don’t want that for your kids, then (I am sorry to be judgmental) but I feel bad for your kids. We need to teach them to respect the rights of others, and realize that while Freedom of Speech in our country is protected for adults it is not for kids within a school environment. In Tinker vs Des Moines school district in 1969 the Supreme Court affirmed those limitations. Before researching this I had never heard of this Supreme Court decision, and reading it for 10 minutes does not make me an expert. It just makes me aware that there are laws in our country in which I was not aware.

To any high school students reading this, your postings and those of you whom have made your thoughts known at public meetings/forums I commend you. You have had some of the most honest and passionate thoughts for making OHS what you want it to be.

We cannot change the past. However, each of us can decide whether we want to be a part of the problem or a part of the solution.

By: pookah on 11/24/09
What we have is a collateralization of a festering problem. What's the problem? Owatonna people in general hold everything inside until it's time to unleash all of the hell swallowed into their subconcious.

1) Administration needs to enforce the rules, punishments and rewards, fairly. If Somalis are attacking anyone, then they are fair game to be suspended et al. If anyone but a Somali is attacking anyone, they are fair game to be suspended et al.

2) If there are any racial issues at all, don't be surprised. However, I think most of the people I've discussed this situation with told me, without a doubt, there are serious concerns of allowing a Somali student to sucker punch someone, outside of the entire conflict, then see the person retaliate as any teenager would do, and then see the Somali who started the fight NOT get suspended while the other teenager did get suspended. Hmmmm... Why would anyone respect: 1) the administration for looking the other way (yet again), and 2) why would you respect the Somali community for leveraging their position of being "unaccountable" for any of these acts.

By: truthbetold on 11/24/09
alittlebitofsugar...well said.

By: cialunatic on 11/24/09
Bobo777, the 1st amendment I don't think was "hijacked" in this situation but it is hard to be certain without actually reading the article that started this whole thing. In the USA the constitution is very important and gives us certain rights. If the student observed something and reports it and it is fact or even an opinion that rules are favoring a certain group and it's not fair and that's the way he sees it, this is protected under the 1st amendment. The 1st amendment is only put aside if it's 100% not true and it is damaging to an individual or said group(an example would be to tell people that a person was stealing from an employer and you knew it wasn't true and that person got fired). It is in my opinion based on what I have to go on that the 1st amendment does protect this individual. I do think the person could have used discretion in writing this or maybe wrote it in a general sense, but it doesn't warrant getting beat by a big group of people. It is also in my opinion that the mob mentality is just unintelligent low-life mentality and this comment has nothing to do woth race or culture. If you handle a situation and you are white I say join the crowd. We as people have to work on a solution and try not to be part of the problem.

By: sam on 11/24/09
It sounds like the school district and the city are running the same ship. They both ignore the problems and hope they go away, never do they address the problems and find a solution. Let's just sweep it under the rug and see what happens, or we can make new policies for the ones that have caused the damage. What ever happened to being proactive instead of reactive!!! Take a closer look at who is employed in the public sector, and are they REALLY doing their job, or is everyone following the mafias?

By: sam on 11/24/09
YUP!!! The newest trend in home decorating or in these cases office decorating.

By: Drew on 11/24/09
Bush, quit tying up the library's computer. Get a job and do something constructive.

By: cialunatic on 11/25/09
Bobo777, have you read the actual blog that started the events? If not you might use a little discretion when posting an opinion on here. Without the writings of the the student we don't know for sure that it was ignorance and stupidity on his part. Also if in fact there is a problem that one group of people are able to do something that another group can't is that shaming them or merely reporting something that is true? Finally the comments could be directed more toward a lack of enforcement by the people in charge at the school. I do know one thing for sure, the mob mentality and beatings do show stipdity and the actions of low-life's. How are we to change our perception of the Somali people if this is how they handle a simple situation like this? Fortunately for me I've met some good ones and know they are not all like this.

By: Jesus_isKing on 11/25/09
Americansweetheart-your comments are the kind that brought on the type of tension that started this years ago. And who are you to call others ignorant? At least the boy that originally wrote the paper did not fight others with his fist. 'The pen is mightier than the sword.'

AND YES, I also heard that women would not be served at the Jubba restaurant. Any non-somolian women try it yet?

Being around the youth, I have honestly seen many somolians not only disrespect women, and girls, but white men! What is up with that kind of bringing up?

Back up there median. A LOT of people care deeply about the opportunity to have a prayer room. Thousands of people in Owatonna start their day off with prayers! If one religion has one, use common sense and allow this for others too OHS.

A lot of this is disrespect. To each other and to ourselves. You bet-a parent will defend their child. And you can guess that some of what the youth say is not totally full of accurate information. It is a common thing to do! It is hard to know what I read is totally correct.

I am not sure if anyone knows what to do and how to do the repair......

pookah on 11/24/09-good thoughts. thanks.