By: atlascollapsed on 10/29/09
"However, the slashing cuts to Minnesota Human Services budgets have trickled down to the local level." I've noticed in the OPP that the budget cuts are almost always refered to as "slashing." It's just a thought but maybe in some article they could refer to the cuts as "necessary" or financially prudent."

As to the dollar amounts of the cuts mentioned they are being stated in comparison what they asked for, not what they recieved last year. Only the CCSA has last years numbers which in quick math looks to be down 30%. I dont have the numbers in front of me but I know the states HHS budget was not cut by 30%. For some reason The 5%-7% range pops into mind.

Things are tough and many families are going through life with less this year than they had last year. I see no reason why the govt and charities cant simply do the same.

By: secretsquirrel on 10/29/09
Have a heart AC! There are charities that might go out of business because of this! What would we do if we didn't have our government contributing public money to private charities that are not self-sustaining due to lack of community support? Why, something terrible might happen like, the budget might be balanced, or people might have to actually make that enormous choice (whether or not to donate their earnings to a particular charity) for themselves.
Government is doing us a favor by lifting this burden from our backs. Sheesh! You simply don't understand what a blow this is to everyone....
Simply stated:
I never have and never will support public money being given to private charities. I hear the term 'corporate welfare' bandied about these threads almost every single day.
No public money should go to ANY private entity. Period. Get rid of tax credits, get rid of bailouts, get rid of charitable contributions completely. Set a tax rate and stick with it.
If a community believes a cause is worthwhile, we are perfectly capable of making our own contributions in support of that and that is what it should be: A personal choice, not a public mandate.
There are laws on the books that allow union members to recover money from dues payments that the union donates in support of a political pursuit if it goes contrary to the member's beliefs. Why then, does the public not have that right? If your tax dollars are going to charity via the government or through your own choice, why can't you write that portion of your income off as nontaxable?
I have slashed my food budget this year by 60%. I am not eating less but the menu I had requested (17oz sirloins every night for supper and 30 year old Famous Grouse every weekend) is beyond my means so I had to settle for steak only one night a week. It's tough but I'll just have to hunker down and deal with it.

By: anonymousbikerdude on 10/29/09
Bear in mind that these agencies are there to help the people who feel the brunt of the recession most. For some this will mean skipping meals altogether. This year, I encourage you to put your money where your mouth is and give, privately and of your own free will. This will bolster your argument that we are capable of taking care of our own without governmental intervention.

By: MNBear on 10/29/09
What anonymous glosses over is that many (if not most) of us ALREADY give what we can (and sometimes more) to charities of our own choosing. I, and many others, are already putting our money (and time) where our mouthes are. I have to agree with ss - government has no business funding ANY private organization. I have to further wonder why these outfits exist - doesn't government ALREADY provide housing, food, medical care, transportation, and more? Why should there even be a need for the food shelf? Why are we paying a non-profit to pair up kids with mentors? These are valid questions, and, as of yet, no one has a good answer other than it's, "because we care." No, you don't care - you want the public addicted to government to justify more power and money going to the state (or feds or the county). Imagine the charity we could undertake if only 50%+ of our money wasn't being taken by government to give to the half of society that pays no taxes at all (i.e., societal leaches).

By: huskysportsnut on 10/29/09
It is time for those that can to step up. Donate a coat, a Thanksgiving meal, some cash. These organization are there to support those in need. We have plenty of opportunities to help out. Keep your charitable donations local this year where we can get the biggest bang for the buck. Who knows, next year it could be you or someone you know that needs the help.

By: anonymousbikerdude on 10/29/09
I didn't gloss over nuthin' ... to be clear, if you are already giving what you can this year, my comments were not directed at you. We have a food shelf because there are kind people who don't want to let their neighbors (and their neighbor's children) go hungry. We have BBBS because there are people who recognize that children are our future. Reasonable minds can differ on the role of government in caring for those in need, but if it is your position that it is not the role government, it becomes the moral imperative of the individual.

By: HappyKat on 10/29/09
The Clothesline (and other nonprofits) would gladly accept private donations. In fact about 85% of the Clothesline's budget comes from private sources. I encourage all of you to contact Mary at the Clothesline 451-2550 to make your private donation to make up for the funding that will be missed this year.

While I understand concerns about donating public money to non-profits, one thing that is overlooked is that non-profits serve clients much cheaper than a government entity can. Can you imagine the cost for the government to assist with a coat drive? Or what about the healthcare cost associated with not having proper winter attire in Minnesota? I have a box of clothes that no longer fit me, should I drop it off on Kelly Harder's desk and ask him to distribute it to people that need it?

While I understand there is a stereotype about the type of people that use nonprofit services, it is just that: a stereotype. When we can take one small burden off of a battered woman who comes in with her two children in literally their pajamas in the middle of January, the benefits to the community are tremendous. Or how about the disabled that use our services, why hasn't someone in this community taken one disabled person shopping for a winter coat? What about the children who didn't ask to be in the situation they are in? Would it be ok to tell a hungry child that their parents should learn to use their money better so until they do they should not eat?

This is an age-old debate in our society, and we are not going to all agree. While I am for fiscal responsibility with government spending,until private individuals in this community donate to organizations like the Clothesline on a regular and dependable basis, we will continue to ask the government for a grant to assist with serving residents in need. If you want government to stop spending this money, sign the check, put a stamp on the envelope and send it to Steele County Clothesline, PO Box 933 Owatonna, MN 55060. Or better yet, join our board and help us figure out to balance a budget when regular, dependable funding is not available.

By: momofthree on 10/29/09
I totally agree with Happykat. How can any one say that these nonprofits don't need to be here for people. MnBear, I think you better be careful it what you say because god forbid you or your family may need some help sometime and there not be any where for you to turn, maybe you should volunteer at one of these places and see how many people benefit from coming to the food shelf or using the Clothesline. It just may be the eye opening experience you need to see that not everyone is as well off as you are,or as you think you are. I have seen firsthand that alot of those who use the services at the Clothesline look forward to the one time a week they can come in and shop, sometimes it is the only thing they can count on in their life. We need to keep these organizations, everyone can benefit from them.

By: charliebrown on 10/29/09
I do not mind helping non-profits as long as "most" of the money goes to help the needy and not to salaries. "Some" non-profit directors make good money.

By: HappyKat on 10/29/09
Nonprofits are held very accountable for their budgets which do include salaries. These budgets are reviewed by their boards, by Grant providers including a Financial Committee on the United Way, the County, and private grant providers.
Non-profit employees put in many hours outside of the normal 30-40 hour work week that their salary is judged against. Directors earn every penny of their salary and that is the first thing that gets looked at when budgets have to be cut. Just like every other business out there. For example if a director is making approx. $30,000 per year that equates to approx. $15/hour. I would guess that is a similar wage to a beginning level manufacturing job in this town. Most directors have post-secondary education, get few if any benefits (including health insurance and 401K), and work many more than 40 hours per week speaking at events, attending community meetings, working late nights on grant writing, taking classes, etc. So while it may seem like "good money," comparatively speaking it's the same or less.

There is a publication available from the MN Nonprofit council that compares salaries of non-profit employees for experience, education level, geographic region, etc. in MN that you can find more specific information on.

By: HappyKat on 10/29/09
Link to 2008 MN Nonprofit Salary & Benefits Survey: http://www.mncn.org/publications.htm

By: Thuljunior on 10/29/09
I don't think anyone is disagreeing with the need for charity, but government funded charity is the very definition of an oxymoron.

The more we use tax money to fund things that used to be funded with private contributions, the more we need to raise taxes to pay for everything. The more we raise taxes, the more people can't afford to make ends meet and need the help of charity. It's an ever increasing cycle.

By: Jesus_isKing on 10/29/09
HappyKat-thanks for the reminder of those in the area that need, REALLY need help. If everyone went through their closet and found one item and donated it to Clothes Closet we could eliminate many needs. The same for the Food Shelf. One item from our shelf or cabinet won't be missed by most of us in Steele County. It is a wonderful feeling to know you have helped someone. This time of year especially. Yes it can be hard. And as someone wrote-help with your time. We don't need to sit in front of the tv so much.

By: atlascollapsed on 10/29/09
It's so nice to see that so many people have such great ideas about what I should do with not only my money but my time as well.

I wonder if Jacob Marley will come visit me tonight after posting that????

By: anonymousbikerdude on 10/29/09
You did invite the discussion by starting this thread off with your statement that you see no reason why charities can't make do with less this year than they had last year.

By: atlascollapsed on 10/29/09
I did and they should. Nowhere in my first thread did I invite people to tell me or others what we should be doing.

The CCSA is giving out tax dollars, not money donated by choice. The article laments the fact that there aren't enough tax dollars to go around yet I dont know many people who are paying any less in taxes? If they are, good for them!

Legislated charity isn't charity, it's redistribution based not on equality but guilt.

By: NewHome on 10/29/09
atlas, I hope that you are never in need of these services. I would never tell someone what they "should" be doing with their money, however your judgements are unfortunate. They are yours, however, and yours to keep.

By: owatonna_1st on 10/29/09
People are paying less in taxes because they are spending less so sales tax dollars going to St. Paul are down. That is why there is less money available to these organizations.

By: quinn on 10/29/09
AC hasn't said that he isn't guided by his conscience, he's simply saying he doesn't want to be mandated by someone else's.

By: secretsquirrel on 10/29/09
Well said quinn!
I donate time, money and items to charities I (emphasis on "I") deem worthy. I do not have that option with my tax dollars. So far, my taxes have gone to buy a lot of new cars, pay for contract disputes, buy insufficient quantities of questionable vaccines, $100,000 went to pay for a fine "against the school district" (that would be..... all of us) because the people who are paid with more of my tax dollars could not agree on a freaking contract..... yeah, I just LOVE forking my money over to the government. They are grandly efficient and supremely intelligent.
I think that when more people stop thinking in terms of "tax money" as opposed to thinking in terms of "my/your money" when they see the largess and waste in government, they may gain a better perspective and push for change.
The HRA in Faribault just had an article glowing over their great financial position this quarter.... If someone moves into HRA housing, lives there for one year to establish residency in Rice County, they get $400 a month. If they decide to move to the cities, they get $800 and guess who pays for it...? Rice County!
Yeah, I would say I am not interested in any justification or rationale for government donating to or supporting charities. I would (and DO) much rather choose where my donations go instead of entrusting politicians and bureaucrats with my money.
Private charities really ARE more efficient. They HAVE to be. That's the difference between private and public operations. Private ones have to stay within their budgets. Public ones just make a bigger budget to accommodate their increased spending.

By: Are_you_serious on 10/30/09
It is sad to hear about these cuts especially for BBBS. With the clothesline I am not a huge supporter I see several people that go in once a week and take clothing and sell clothing to make profit. That is wrong perhaps changing some rules would be postive in the future. In all reality we don't shop once a week for clothing or need as much as what I have seen people take from there especially when you see some people wearing expensive clothing as they shop and take from those that could really use it. Again it is sad to see that funds are being cut as we all are faced with dramitic changes in our lives and we will figure out something as we always do as a community. Some will just have to realize that some are not so willing do to what we see as being taken advantage by others. SO be patient it will work out eventually. Perhaps what the salvation army doesn't want the clothesline can have since the salvation army is picky about what is given to them.

By: anonymousbikerdude on 10/30/09
Well alrighty then, as long as atlascollapsed never purports to tell any of us what we should be doing differently, we're all good here. Honestly you'd think this article would be cause celebre as the brunt of the article is that fewer of your tax dollars are now going to the poor and needy.

By: atlascollapsed on 10/30/09
Actually my tax dollars are still going to the poor and needy. Rather than being given to the "charities" they are being kept to pay for staterun charities like welfare, MNcare, section 8 housing, foodstamps etc.

And to be honest I dont think I tell people what to do too often. (B&B excluded) I often times say what I think govt should do though.